season3...epi2...glass ballerina

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 11, 2006

season3...epi2...glass ballerina

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

My first thought I need to drop in on this epi is that I'm wondering if the Others have a small raft type thing? The others on the boat were as dry as if they had come from the shore, but if they did I can't see how they got past Jin and Sayid both watching.

Then I'd like to ask this....does anyone think that Sun's father either pushed Jae from the ledge (or window) or at the very least had Jin followed to ensure the job was done in case Jin backed out?

Island_Reigns · Yay Lost!!

You know, Snootch, I was wondering the same thing. That really made me sad that Jae had to end up dying. How horrible would that have been for Jin to think he was doing the right thing and saving the guy's life only to have him possibly commit suicide or be killed anyway? What a thing to have over your head the rest of your life.

Then on the other hand... the person that Sun shot said she wasn't a killer. What if she is? What if she finished the job Jin had started?

LionQueen · It Doesn't Matter Who We Were Before ...

That's what I wondered - if perhaps Sun pushed him out to protect Jin. Jae was clasping her pearl necklace.

I also believe that Jin and Sayid weren't watching the boat. It appeared to me that they were looking away, with their backs to the boat.

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

Well in regards to the necklace that's why I think it may have been suicide. He could have been sitting there and then just decided to save face, and die an honorable death (hari kari I think it's called) would be better then to run. I really can't see how Sun would have been able to push him out the window. the only chance of that would have been if he was near the window facing out it and she got behind him, and even then I'm thikning she's have to almost run at him to get him out without her going with. Also how would she have gotten him that close to the window before Jin could even move his car?

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

Island_Reigns wrote:Then on the other hand... the person that Sun shot said she wasn't a killer. What if she is? What if she finished the job Jin had started?

And with the girl (she was the daughter of the one guy that was messing with Sawyer) she shot I think it's very possible that she could have done that and maybe could have killed Jae if it wasn't for what I explained already. Her shot at the girl seemed very much the self defense (sort of like the natural reaction shot by Michael that killed Libby). But we did learn one thing about her early on in the episode. She knows how to sail (did Jin know this?) and I'm betting there's many other things outside that and gardening that she knows but she hasn't shown yet.

LionQueen · It Doesn't Matter Who We Were Before ...

Sun is coming out of her shell and becoming more and more of the strong independant woman she really is underneath the meek subserviant stuff. Much to my chagrin, just when I start forgiving Jin he becomes an A$$hole once more!

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

LionQueen wrote:

Sun is coming out of her shell and becoming more and more of the strong independant woman she really is underneath the meek subserviant stuff. Much to my chagrin, just when I start forgiving Jin he becomes an A$$hole once more!

But you notice that it didn't last long, and he also had good reason to be that way IMO. I know if Angie and I were in that situation my first concern would be her well being, and if I had to be gruff with her to get her to do what I thought was best (even if it's not the right thought) I would. if I were in Jin's place I really wouldn't have thought of going with in the first place. My loyalties are strong, but my first is and always will be my family.

GrayLensman · See you in another life!!!

Paul Newman watch out. It's Cool Hand Sawyer!

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

i have alread made my statement on the glass.. now why a ballerina??? this is a graceful dancer... highly diciplined and devoted ... strong as can be yet fragile in appearance... hmmmmm... is that sun?? kate??? claire??? also, don't ballerinas have a reputation for being rather temperamental???

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

one thing to be noted, this episode was about lies ... it started with a lie and, for all we know, ended with one...

sayid lied to sun
sun lied to jin
sawyer and kate were lying to the others
paik lied to sun
sun was living a lie in having a relationship with jae

are half-truths also lies??? and what about white lies???

and look at ben's name... linus...lioness..lyoness...lyonus... we will have to wait to see what the spelling of his last name is... but it basically says..lie....

are lies like glass....

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

ben and juliet have a somewhat strained relationship... hmmm who else bickered like this??? was it...jack and locke???

different people lead in different ways... no saying right or wrong but a little tension like this can add to progresss...

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

in ther name of behavior modification... sawyer and kate were given a menial job and punished when they didn't do it... and part of jack's plan was there to seee what the others are made of... to look for a way to escape... this is the second encounter between sawyer and juliet... sawyer sees her as an equal really... no qualms about doing what is needed to survive.... he is in the wild and something tells me if she gave him the chance he would bed her.... and then escape with kate and maybe jack...

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

does jin know about sun's affair? paik gave him enough clues... 'my shame is your shame...' 'YOU need to restore your family's honor...' jin can figure out that sayid is lying, what michael is saying and so much more... certainly he can figure out what the 'family disgrace' has been... 'this man stole something from me... 'and only you can right the wrong.... jinn wants to quit and paik calls him son..... another clue as to what happened... jin loves sun and goes to avenge the dishonor... he loves her tooo much to take away even her forbidden happinesss.. so he warns jae and tells him to leave... did jae suicide or get help in going out the window??? we may never know other than to know that he loved sun and would die for her.... as sun would do for jin... and probably he for her.... i think he knows... even down to how this may not be his baby.... yet he loves her no matter what....

that's love....

or is it a lie???

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

jack at the end... the writers give us a big clue as to how to watch this show...

change your perspective....

why is that so hard to do???

ben's last words, in his promise to jack....'i will take you home....' not send or show or lead... but take.... hmmmmmmmmmmm.... what does that mean??

or is it just another lie...

he will lie many times before he tells you the truth....

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

there is more but i need sleep... later, dudes!!

LionQueen · It Doesn't Matter Who We Were Before ...

That's what I said - if this man has never ever been to the outside world, why on God's green earth would he up and accompany Jack back to "home" ?

Island_Reigns · Yay Lost!!

Well he has been watching Jack on camera for a while now... maybe he wants Jack to choose him over Kate? Just kidding!

LL, you bring up many good points! I was wondering the same about the ballerina.

These writers are doing a good job of messing with our heads! I mean that in a good way!

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

WOW LL...you really dug in good to this epi. I'm fully in the line of thought that Jin knows about Sun and Jae. That packet of info on Jae would have most likely have had info on that situation. Hence the reason Jin went nuts on him right away, but then his knowledge that he hasn't been the best husband to Sun was why he felt pity on Jae and allowed him the chance to move on but to stay hidden. The rage he used to beat Jae down is a jealous rage not a passive man doing his job because he's related to the boss.

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

LionQueen wrote:

That's what I said - if this man has never ever been to the outside world, why on God's green earth would he up and accompany Jack back to "home" ?

how old is ben??? my estimate is in his 40s??? at least... that would put his birthday around 1966??? that was prior to dharma and the degroots.... i think ben lied....

oh!!! the blog on msn spells his last name lyons...

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

LionQueen wrote:

Sun is coming out of her shell and becoming more and more of the strong independant woman she really is underneath the meek subserviant stuff. Much to my chagrin, just when I start forgiving Jin he becomes an A$$hole once more!

sun has always been strong and independent.... she knows how to bow to the korean male as a survival tactic... but for the most part she is much like her father.... this is her flaw... remember that jin said he married a strong willed woman when he was talking to his father... jin is that one we have underestimated as far as his grasp of what is going on and what he is capable of!!

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

LL....I don't think that he's lying about being there all his life. That is the one thing I actually think is true. if you think of him as early 40's then he very well could be telling the truth. I'm 35 and born in 71. So if he was there in 66 or so that would make him no younger than 39....and he never stated that he was born on the island. He could have been a year or two old, and the island is all he's ever known.

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

snootch2danootch wrote:

WOW LL...you really dug in good to this epi. I'm fully in the line of thought that Jin knows about Sun and Jae. That packet of info on Jae would have most likely have had info on that situation. Hence the reason Jin went nuts on him right away, but then his knowledge that he hasn't been the best husband to Sun was why he felt pity on Jae and allowed him the chance to move on but to stay hidden. The rage he used to beat Jae down is a jealous rage not a passive man doing his job because he's related to the boss.

hello my friends!!! (i see island too) and so glad we have this time together!!

yes... definitely a jealous rage... so well acted!!! and jae with his guilt... can't you see him curled up on the floor in his room, squeezing the string of pearls, knowing he will never see her again, crying... and then suddenly neck snapped and body thrown out the window....

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

i forgot to mention the boat!!! we have to remember the name of the boat... elizabeth... libby.... did ben want libby? know libby??

i think this is something we have to remember as this year progresses...

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

lockesladyness wrote:i forgot to mention the boat!!! we have to remember the name of the boat... elizabeth... libby.... did ben want libby? know libby?? i think this is something we have to remember as this year progresses...

HUH...I forgot about that being the name of the boat. So since we know he has contact with the outside I'm wondering if he's been instructed (Pen's Dad?) to get that boat at all costs for him. Maybe as proof to Penny or her dad that Des is stuck on the island.

lockesladyness · Date: Oct 12, 2006

snootch2danootch wrote:

HUH...I forgot about that being the name of the boat. So since we know he has contact with the outside I'm wondering if he's been instructed (Pen's Dad?) to get that boat at all costs for him. Maybe as proof to Penny or her dad that Des is stuck on the island.

... or that des is dead???

LionQueen · It Doesn't Matter Who We Were Before ...

>HUH...I forgot about that being the name of the boat. So since we know he has contact with the outside I'm wondering if he's been instructed (Pen's Dad?) to get that boat at all costs for him. Maybe as proof to Penny or her dad that Des is stuck on the island.

Well, that's half of the reason why in my fic, I had sarah say her middle name was Elizabeth because it was both the name of the boat and Libby's name. Libby is short for Elizabeth. ;)

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

Lion that's cool how you are working so many things from the show into your story.

LionQueen · It Doesn't Matter Who We Were Before ...

Thanks!

Sir Snootch · "Gamers don't sleep. They just nap between levels."

Does anyone else get the idea that now that the roles are reversed for Ben and jack that they truely are? I mean Ben now wants to give Jack the chance to prove himself to him and the others like Jack wanted to believe in ben (as henry).

Now Jack I believe is doing what Ben did in his position. PLaying the game to see what they do and how they all react. I know them bringing up Sarah must have hit him hard, but I think at the same time it's one of the things he mmay have broken away from enough (when he did the tat and that stuff we'll be finding out about) so that he has a clear head, and now it's his turn to play the gamewith them.